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Sunday, December 04, 2011

Occupy Wall Street? Gypsies, Tramps and Thieves...and Bigots...and apparently Democrats?

99% of us are not bullies, criminals, communists and slackers.   OWS have no right to pretend to represent the average American, even if they do represent the Obama Administration and his Communist buddies.  Excerpt:

"...To dismiss these rabble-rousers as mere nuisance would be a gross underestimation not only of their Saul Alinsky-style direct action and community organizing capabilities, but of the ideological alliance between these street activists and the far more patient radicals who have infiltrated Congress, shaped Barack Obama’s presidential agenda, and now in fact threaten the future of our country. (For those of you not familiar with Alinsky, he is considered the father of modern community organizing.)..."

I do not believe that John F. Kennedy was perfect.   I do not believe he was the best President we ever had.  In fact, he did not have much time to build a legacy as President because he was shot down in November of 1963.  I suspect his father made sure lots of dead people voted for him in Chicago to ensure it was a Kennedy and not a Nixon who took office after the 1960 election.  But I also know that JFK loved his country.  He'd served as a WWII PT boat commander and his life was in danger at times during his service and I am sure you all know the story of his PT 109 being sunk and his bravery in rescuing his men.  His older brother, Joe Jr., lost his life serving in WWII.   John and Robert Kennedy were Democrats in a day when Democrats were anti-Communist, anti-Socialist and Pro-America.  Once both parties generally supported capitalism and freedom and the Constitution, they just had policy differences about how to go about doing it.

John F. Kennedy said this in his Inaugural Address:

Picture and text credit

"...In the long history of the world, only a few generations have been granted the role of defending freedom in its hour of maximum danger. I do not shrink from this responsibility -- I welcome it. I do not believe that any of us would exchange places with any other people or any other generation. The energy, the faith, the devotion which we bring to this endeavor will light our country and all who serve it. And the glow from that fire can truly light the world.

And so, my fellow Americans, ask not what your country can do for you; ask what you can do for your country.

My fellow citizens of the world, ask not what America will do for you, but what together we can do for the freedom of man.

Finally, whether you are citizens of America or citizens of the world, ask of us here the same high standards of strength and sacrifice which we ask of you. With a good conscience our only sure reward, with history the final judge of our deeds, let us go forth to lead the land we love, asking His blessing and His help, but knowing that here on earth God's work must truly be our own."

Democrats, one of your own condemns you with words that resonate with truth even today.
Kennedy's words are in accord with the Constitution and the Declaration of Independence.  This administration is apparently intent upon turning the United States into The Socialist States of America. The current Democratic Party is so radically left that JFK would probably see that they more closely resemble his Communist enemies than his fellow Americans.  I suppose JFK would be a Republican today rather than associate with the kind of people who would organize and encourage Occupy Wall Street.

The Tea Party Movement is not dead, but it was and is a genuine grassroots movement of ordinary Americans tired of seeing the Federal Government taking away rights from States and citizens and spending money a a record rate.  While the Tea Partiers have had meetings in various cities and towns all over the United States for several years now, they have had some commonalities;
  • They get permits when they need them to gather in pubic places that require them.
  • They clean up after themselves.
  • They remain law abiding, even when people are sent to try to cause them to react to bad behavior.
  • They consist primarily of people who have jobs or attend schools so they come for a period of time and then peacefully disperse.
They Occupy Wall Street people are pretty much the opposite:
  • They have lots of paid instigators leading them to do what they do.
  • They consist of people who do not have anything constructive to do like, say, work a job or go to school or go look for a job.  In other words, the ones who are not being paid to be there are slackers...or crooks...or bigots...or entirely clueless but think anarchy is fun.
  • They make a great big mess whereever they are.
  • They are constantly committing crimes like assault, rape, larceny, resisting arrest and etc.
So I ask you, how dare the OWS people claim to be representing 99 % of the people?  Do we primarily consist of union thugs, criminals, bums and people hired by the Democratic Party to try to invent an anti-Tea Party?  No, we do not.!  

Fact:  53% of Americans pay 100% of the Federal taxes. (article reproduced near bottom of post) 

So the thugs and bums of OWS do not represent a majority at all.   In fact, a normal person who is out of work begins putting in applications to get a job, or goes to (or back to) school to get the training to get a job in a specific field.   When I was injured and could no longer work in the industry that I was in,  I got a student loan and went back to college and retrained to work in the IT industry.  I got a job in that industry because I worked hard at training for a new career.  If you do not have a job, you should be working full-time to get a new job or get training for a new job.  

Only slackers and bums and crooks expect the government to support them.   Guess what, you have no right to be supported.  The government spends money taken from people who work.   Are those who work supposed to support those those who won't?   Of couse not!

Occupy Starts, Stops with Trash

John Ransom                

"30 tons of leftover waste as a monument seems fitting somehow for a protest movement made up of the intellectual trash-bin of the country’s- the world's?- left wing.  Europe is forcing balanced budgets, so one has to wonder how long the FDR-Keynesian crowd can pretend to be anything other than an historical curiosity.

When police evicted the protesters from in and around city hall in LA, hazmat teams found personal items that “astonished city workers,” according to the LA Times.

The protesters left “books and CDs, luggage and boom boxes, mattresses and dining chairs, cellphones, electric razors, a small red guitar with its neck snapped –- all surrounded by dozens of collapsed and empty tents.”

Hazmat teams had to come in to clean up the mess. Imagine dozens of Carl Spacklers squeegee-ing out the grounds of LA’s city hall.    

And thus, the contrast between the Tea Party protesters and the Occupiers is now complete.

Good going to all those media sophisticates who tried to tell us that the Occupy movement was the left’s mirror image of the Tea Party.

Forget the double-standard that the media has applied to the two movements when they reported on them. The double standard just makes the media look more foolish in the end. 

And you know the end is near for any political movement when TB breaks out amongst people freely-associating for political purposes- and smoking a little weed

Pot kind of gives a different context to the idea of a grassroots movement.

Don’t get me wrong. There are Tea Partiers, who, uh, party. But outside of the Paulites, they don’t make partying part of the officially sanctioned activities.

The Tea Party folks would have just brought some sort of cheese-covered casseroles and maybe some bottled water and s’mores to a rally- and then gone home a few hours later to spend time with their families.

Occupiers brought communicable diseases.

Now that’s a type of “communism” in action; hope you can believe in.  

The great thing about the mainstream media is that the coffin nails which are sealing up the pine box surrounding them are being fashioned everyday by themselves.

They haven’t made a right call since they asked John Kerry to report for duty in his yachting cap and ascot.      

Give them this though:  The Occupiers' trash shows that they apparently are sincere when they trash the materialism of the lower, middle and upper classes. But it’s easy to discard material things in a park in LA when your first demands are that someone else pay for those things in the first place.

Easy come is easy go when a third party pays the tab.

Still, the urban cognoscenti from New York Magazine has noted the much fairer way that NYPD treated trash the Occupiers left behind when kicked out of Zuccotti Park.

“By contrast, when the OWS protesters at Zuccotti Park were unceremoniously evicted,” whines NYMag, “the debris was taken to a sanitation facility at West 57th Street where protesters with ‘proper ID’ could recover their belongings once waste was sorted from personal property. Why weren't the L.A. protesters afforded the same opportunity?”

They are so right: It’s just not fair.

I say make the Occupiers pick up and sort their own trash next time."

Thirty tons of trash just in LA?  Now multiply it around the country.   Various municipalities have had to give OWS bums the heave-ho and it is no wonder.   Last week marked arrest number FIVE THOUSAND of the OWS protesters.  I guess they are protesting cleanliness and lawfulness. 

Here are a few pictures and the lead text from an OCCUPY OAKLAND PHOTOJOURNALISM POST.  I ask you, is this representative of who you are?

"Much ado has been made about recent media reports describing Occupy Oakland as a cross between Lord of the Flies and Animal House. The leftist magazine Mother Jones was furious about the negative coverage, deeming it "The Right-Wing Media Assault on Occupy Oakland," and attempting to debunk the bad press. But Big Journalism lashed back with an article entitled MotherJones: Truth To Unflattering Reports On OWS.

Out of curiosity, I decided to check out the scene for myself to settle the matter."


Everywhere I went, I encountered people taking drugs -- mostly marijuana. Many of them were understandably camera-shy. But this guy stood right on the main walkway and puffed away on a drug pipe.

The ground around and inside the camp was also littered with other evidence of drug use, such as this crack cocaine baggie that had been dropped or discarded.

This guy was sitting outside his tent, riffling through and counting huge wads of greenbacks. I can't say for sure that he was a drug dealer, but I found it mighty suspicious that he would have such a massive amount of cash amidst such squalor.


Occupy Oakland has agreed by consensus to not cooperate with the Oakland Police Department under any circumstances. But as the law-breaking and nuisance behavior within the encampment started to grow, the evolving mini-society found it necessary to appoint its own ersatz police force. Basically, the scariest looking guys, and/or those guys with with strongest authoritarian urge, have assumed the role of internal policemen. As many reporters have discovered, these guys really really do not appreciate having their picture taken, so I could only get a few surreptitious shots. In this scene, someone had found a large Bowie knife in the camp and turned it into these two Occupolice, who set about scanning the crowd for the potential owner, ready to wreak justice on anyone who broke the "no weapons" law consensus agreement. They communicate with walkie-talkies.

There also seemed to be a possibly separate "rally security force" consisting of guys wearing Black Panther buttons on their berets.


But not all is rosy in this new society. Some of the very worst customs already banned from our existing society have re-emerged at Occupy Oakland. One of the ugliest of these is segregation.

The encampment has already fractured into a series of micro-neighborhoods, just like a real city. But at Occupy Oakland, where you are permitted to live is determined by your gender and/or racial or sexual identity. Here, for example, is a roped-off "gated community" reserved exclusively for female, gay and transgender residents.

Elsewhere are tents with a "minorities only" rule.

And lest you might be so naive to think that these rules would only ever apply to the Occupy camp, and not to the city at large should the Occupiers ever take over, be aware that one of the Occupation's many demands is to "Stop White Gentrification in Oakland" -- which would mean the establishment of new laws preventing white people from moving into certain neighborhoods.

Yes, my friends, the Occupy movement has made segregation trendy again!

They aleady have this in Middle Eastern society; it's called a harem.


There is much more at the site.   Lots of Communists and Socialists and anti-society anti-American groups along with lots of criminals and slackers.   Funny how many decry capitalism while talking or texting on cell phones, eh?

Occupy Wall St. Hits New Milestone: 5,000 Arrests

"After more than two months of assaults, vandalism, resisting arrest, and more, the Occupy Wall Street movement has a new accomplishment: more than 5,000 arrests.

The most recent tally, handled by the Occupy Arrests Twitter feed, was from Nov. 25 and was at 4,752. But, arrests of Occupiers in Los Angeles and Philadelphia last night should push that total to a new milestone.

According to the Associated Press, LA police arrested “more than 200 who defied orders to leave.” AP reported that another 52 were arrested in the City of Brotherly Love, safely pushing the total above 5,000.

Confronting police and getting arrested has been a primary Occupier strategy since roughly 700 people were arrested trying to seize the Brooklyn Bridge on Oct. 1. Since that date, the battles between police and Occupiers have spanned the globe.

Occupy Arrests, which tracks the arrests by location, shows New York is the top city for arrests. More than 1,400 Occupiers have been arrested at Wall Street alone. Chicago, Tucson, Boston, and Oakland have also been hot spots for arrests. But close behind is Melbourne, Australia, with more than 100 arrests on its own.

Arrests in some of those cases were very confrontational, but AP said last night’s were “relatively peaceful.” “By dawn in Los Angeles, trash, flattened tents and the stench of urine were the Occupy LA legacy,” according to AP."


Meanwhile the most radical President in US history is also the one who has taken the most vacations, so while OWS is wreaking havoc across the nation, Barack Obama is taking another 17 days off work!

So here is the Democrat game plan.   Get radical communist and socialist and union agitators to start a big combination protest and party in cities around the nation, making it even harder to get work done and putting a massive strain on the peace-keepers by providing their own crime wave, drug party and trashfest.   Anarchy is the theme.   Why do the Democrats want anarchy?   Well, if anarchy is widespread, then you get tyranny next.   Socialism can only succeed by tyranny.   It requires a dictator and the loss of individual freedoms in order to exist.   Nations that begin to tend towards Socialism eventually begin changing their collective minds, as we now see European socialist health care programs being revised or abandoned because they simply don't work.  As nations, the Soviet Union and it's satellite nations all fell because Socialism does not work.   In China a form of capitalism is being allowed because capitalism does work.  China has operated on the world stage as a capitalist entity but they have found that allowing citizens to have a return for labor and innovation has increased productivity.

OWS is obviously a plan cooked up by the Democrats, whose leaders do not respect the law or the Constitution.   When a State legislature like the ones in Indiana or Wisconsin get a majority and begin to enact laws the Democrats don't like, they run away to another state like the unAmerican cowards they are.   Is that strong language for you?  Well, ask yourself who was paying for the Wisconsin legislators to run away, who was paying the salaries of Indiana legislators when they bolted last year because they were no longer the majority and they didn't like what the majority wanted to do.  I think any legislator who refuses his or her responsibility should be docked their pay and, if AWOL for a week or longer, be suspended from office and a special election should be held to replace them.    

Hey, if you decide to just quit going to work and deliberately refuse to come, should your boss keep paying you and should you be able to keep your job?   I guarantee you that if you tell your boss you are deliberately avoiding work you would not get paid and you would not keep your job!  Just an aside because Democrats in Indianapolis are threatening to run away again if the Right To Work legislation comes to a vote in the House.   Call them traitors or cowards or slackers or anything you want other than public servants, because when you run away from your job you have run away from the people who you are supposed to serve.   You get elected, you go to work and cast your vote and try to persuade others but what you DO NOT DO IS RUN AWAY!

Anyway, the article I promised AND a video to boot:

The 53%: We are NOT Occupy Wall Street

By Tami Luhby

occupy wall street
Frank Decker has a message for those at Occupy Wall Street.

NEW YORK (CNNMoney) -- Occupy Wall Street protesters might say they represent 99% of the nation, but there's a growing number of Americans who are making it clear they are not part of the dissident crowd.

They call themselves the in the 53% of Americans who pay federal income taxes. And they are making their voices heard on Tumblr blogs, Twitter and Facebook pages devoted to stories of personal responsibility and work ethic.

47% of Americans don't pay federal income tax, according to the nonpartisan Tax Policy Center. The 53 percenters stress the fact that they are paying the taxes that support the government assistance the protesters say they want.

Kevin Eder was among the first to galvanize those who wanted to differentiate themselves from the thousands of people rallying across the nation to raise awareness of the growing economic gap between the rich and everyone else.

In early October, Eder created the Twitter hashtag #iamthe53, which has since been posted in hundreds of tweets as the backlash to Occupy Wall Street mounts.

"I would never identify myself with those occupying Wall Street," said Eder, 26, a business analyst in Washington D.C. "The frustration was born out of people claiming to speak for me who don't."
Meet the Occupy Wall Street protesters

Many of those tweeting share the belief that the protesters need to stop complaining about the government and financial institutions and start looking for work. Ken Gardner, an attorney in Dallas, joined the conversation because he opposes government handouts.

"We don't want to be the 53% who carries the 47% on our shoulders," said Gardner, who thinks more people should pay federal income taxes.

Eder's hashtag helped inspire Erick Erickson, editor-in-chief of the conservative website and a CNN contributor, to set up a Tumblr blog called "We are the 53%." It mimics Occupy Wall Street "We are the 99 percent" site.

"The 53% site gives a voice to those who reject the contention that most Americans are victims of the system," said Josh Trevino, "quasi-official spokesman" for the blog.

"What the 99% is missing is the element of personal responsibility," said Trevino, who is also vice president at the conservative Texas Public Policy Foundation. "The 53% want to bring that into the conversation."

More than a thousand people have sent in entries to the 53% site, which generally features their photo next to a piece of paper that outlines their views, as well as their struggles and work histories.

"I am responsible for my own destiny," writes one 34-year-old father of three. "I will succeed or fail because of me and me alone."

"I took jobs I didn't want. Why don't you?" says one poster to the protesters. "Suck it up and become part of the 53%."
(The original post has a video here that cannot be copied to this site)

As Frank Decker read through the posts, he felt he could relate. A public school teacher in Vancouver, Wash., Decker and his wife lived below the poverty line until they decided to go back to school to become educators. He sent in a post because he wanted to share his story.

"We didn't go through all that struggle while raising three kids to support people who don't feel they need to work or people who feel they are entitled to something they haven't earned," said Decker, 44.
At this point, neither Keder nor Trevino plan to shift their 53% efforts from the online world to the physical one. But they are both surprised at how popular the backlash has become.

"It's lasted far longer than we thought and it's become much bigger than we thought," Trevino said. "It's not over yet."~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

As long as the Democrats and Unions and the Communist Party and other such entities are willing to pay people to protest, the OWS will not end until commnunities get sick and tired of them and forcibly toss them out.  Which is what they have been forced to do, and in doing so pay even more tax dollars in the process.  So in the end the OWS represent the dregs of society...bigots, bullies and bums...and by their own words, Barack Obama and Nancy Pelosi and their cronies.  Nice, huh?


radar said...

Yes, I do sometimes post something political. The hypocrisy and criminality of the OWS is just too much to absorb without saying something. Kind of like Astroturf powdered with cyanide = OWS.

Chaos Engineer said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Chaos Engineer said...

Here's a joke I heard the other day: A banker, a Tea Party member, and an OWS-er are sitting at a table with 12 cookies.

The banker snatches up 11 of the cookies, and then says to the Tea Party member, "Keep an eye on that other guy; he's going to try to steal your cookie."

(The joke is that in real life, there's no need for the banker to say anything.)

As long as we're talking politics, are you supporting anybody in the primary? I think the country could probably survive a Romney presidency, so I'm hoping he gets the nomination.

AmericanVet said...

Well, Obama bailed out the banks after the various idiotic laws that allowed mortgages to be bundled with securities helped kill the economy, so he is no help. Every time he says "stimulus" it means "I have more buddies to pay off and I am taking more of your money." His so-called "jobs bill" is another joke.

We need a Congress and a President who will take the Federal boot off of the throats of investment, energy and business. Then the economy will grow and people will get jobs and quit losing their houses.

Look, bankers make money from investing in loans. They are not evil, they are just necessary. You cannot build a new factory without capital. Banks risk capital and bet on the risk to pay off. They are simply a necessary part of business development.

But the government gets involved and we get Fannie and Freddie and AIG all getting fat on government funds. Remember way back in say 2004 and 2005 when Bush and McCain and the Republicans demanded hearings because they wanted the laws changes and Barney Frank and Maxine Waters were on television telling everyone the system was working fine and the laws didn't need to be changed? I posted a couple of youtubes with them telling us that.

Then comes 2008, the economy is going to hell in part because ACORN involved in selling homes to drug dealers and prostitution rings and folks with no income and the government is helping. The overload of bad mortgage loans helped kill the housing market and the banks and the economy and the now idiotic McCain agrees that we need bailouts!? At that point we didn't even have one good candidate for President. We had a Socialist or an Appeaser with no more real standards anymore.

Remember when Obama said we needed stimulus packages or unemployment would hit 7%? Ha! It is around 10% now and your money is going to the government of Italy and to Solyndra and, oh yeah, we gave truckloads of automatic weapons to Mexican drug cartels so they could kill our border agents and other citizens. Obama stole the pension funds of Indiana firemen while "bailing out" Chrysler by basically giving the money and the company to FIAT and the Italians.

I wish I knew what is really going on in Washington, but OWS should be Occupy Washington DC until the government lowers taxes and quits all the spending.

AmericanVet said...

If I was President I would have to stay inside the White House to avoid assassination. It would probably happen anyway. Before it did, I would take off the shackles of obtaining oil and gas and coal and let atomic energy plants be built. I would get Congress to pass laws that make it illegal to provide work or housing to illegal immigrants. If the employers have to prove their workers are citizens and landlords have to do the same, no place for illegals to work or live and they will have to leave and come in by the front door. I would end birthright citizenship. No visitors or illegals would be able to have "anchor babies." I would make sure the border was secure.

I could affort that because I would eliminate a lot of agencies and make others bare-bones. Every agency would have to provide a budget and a reason for existence. I would ask Congress to undo all Obamacare laws immediately. I would allow health insurers to be nationwide rather than go state by state.

I would quit printing funny money and quit all payments to the UN and wall their property off from the rest of the country and ask them to please relocate to another continent. I would stop all foreign aid to anyone who does not support us. I would welcome all of our allies to join in an alliance with us apart from the UN and maybe call it the FA, Freedom Alliance.

I would force all government employees to live by the laws Congress passes including Congress. I would make each agency post their budget online except those with security issues (CIA, FBI, Armed Forces). I would hire successful businessmen for my cabinet to help me turn the country around. We would disband the IRS and replace it all with a simple tax code like the Fair Tax with modifications. Right now only 53% pay for the 100%. The lowest 25% probably should not have to pay taxes. With a simple tax system we can help the business world grow and all those IRS agents can apply for the Border Patrol or go to work in the real world.

AmericanVet said...

One thing that really makes sense is a national sales tax on items that are discretionary. Speedboats, new automobiles, houses in the top 33% of costs, electronic gadgets, fur coats, all things that the average American doesn't NEED but if they are successful they might want? Tax that. Do not tax food and normal expenditures of the average American. Do not tax used car sales, just new ones. In other words, people with money who want luxuries can pay extra because they can afford it, while the people struggling to make ends meet can buy a five year old car and groceries without being burdened further.

AmericanVet said...

I would get the Federal Government out of the loan business and let go of any partial ownership of private businesses. Also, no unfunded Federal Mandates will be signed by me. If Congress makes a law they have to have a way to pay for it. Let States have their Constitutional rights and responsibilities.

We would not fund art or radio stations or have an NEA or an NCSE for sure. We would bare-bones the EPA so they were tasked with finding companies dumping dangerous chemicals and that kind of thing.

I would absolutely NOT pay for green energy garbage! Let inventors and innovators work and come up with new ideas and promote them. We didn't need to pay for someone to invent the automobile or the airplane or the radio or the television or duct tape or anything like that. Free enterprise, if given room to grow, invents new things and brings about new ways of doing things.

We have enough fossil fuels to easily crank out another 100 years going full speed with today's vehicles, power plants and factories. We have plenty of time for people to find better ways to harness solar energy or energy from geothermal sources or energy generated from converting trash to fuel and so on. Obama wants to throw our money at it. Just let the people go free to do it themselves! Quit handcuffing businesses and killing family budgets by arbitrarily making all things more expensive by stopping us from drilling and mining and so on!

AmericanVet said...

Our Founding Fathers came here to be free to innovate, to worship and to have representation in government. If we simply let the Constitution guide us we would shrink the Federal Government, which is an overbloated tick on our behinds, and allow free enterprise and capitalism and the wondrous ability of men and women to invent and bring new and better products to the public and find new and better ways of producing and using energy.

Socialism always fails. It usually brings tyranny and then tyrants bring about a nation of a few rich and lots of serfs. FDR began us down the road to socialism but Obama and other such Democrats want to go full speed that way. After all, they are the rich, the Pelosi and Obama and Gore types. They'll be part of the ruling class in such a society. The middle class will be eaten up and most of them will become the poor. We'll go back to the Middle Ages like the Soviet Union did and like China did for awhile.

OWS is a bunch of radicals and crooks and bums. Obama and Pelosi like them. If you like radicals and crooks and bums, you must love the current administration because OWS was promoted by them and their union buddies.

The Tea Party movement is from the ordinary Americans who want us to look like America again - Capitalissm and Freedom and the end of racial hatreds altogether. No KKK, No Black Panthers, No bussing kids to other schools, no no no no no! Everybody should be free to PURSUE happiness, nobody has the right to it. Everybody should be free to find a job, nobody has a right to one. Everybody should be free to select a doctor or hospital but no one has the right to health care. Duh. Read the Declaration of Independence and the Constitution. I wonder how many Congressmen and Senators have? Some of them act like they do not know it! The President acts like he does not like either document and apparently would prefer Rules for Radicals.

Okay, I had my soapbox moment.

Anonymous said...

Radar, you may not always post something political but you do ALWAYS post something crazy.

What a weird black-and-white world you live in Radar. Ever consider the fact that government regulations played a significant role in shielding the Canadian Banking System from the 2008 global collapse.

And finally simply slandering and vilifying your perceived opponents only serves to make your position appear weak, as always.


radar said...

I do not villify OWS by showing pictures and presenting descriptions of who they are. Over 5,200 arrests as of Saturday, I am sure that is still going up. They found someone dead in Texas Sunday. OD'd, murdered, suicide, what?

On this blog I predicted the 2008 collapse when I posted the Democrats refusal to fix or kill off Fannie and Freddie. I said then that the economy was going to collapse. Back then I had no idea how bad Obama was going to be. We are now over 15 Trillion in debt here in the USA!!! I was too conservative, Obama and his administration were worse than I imagined.

When I point out what they have done, I am reporting, because they vilify themselves, no help needed.